Champ 7AC, How about those cable actuated brakes?

Bartman

Bartman

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I've been looking at a 65hp Champ that is on the field as a club plane and was wondering what life is like with original cable actuated brakes. Anyone have any experience with them?

It's also got its original engine with a case that has never been opened up. It was topped maybe 400 hours ago but feel free to opine on that as well.

Thanks!
Bart
 
Other than knowing finding parts for them can be interesting at times, and even when working correctly you won’t stay static on a full run up. Never flown one though. Just at annual. I just remember the owner arguing about having to fix them since “you don’t really need brakes to land” 😂 As for the engine, not much experience with the C65 other than the one. But I wouldn’t be to worried if it’s been flying regularly. I would at least follow an oil analysis program to watch for spikes.
 
I have a little experience. Got a field approval and installed Grove from one end to the other. Changed the entire personality of the airplane.

Want to do the same thing to a Taylorcraft L2, but the owner likes cable brakes and Shinn wheels. Wait ’till one of those wheels crack . . .
 
Thanks for the replies. The plane hasn't really been flying as the owner has aged and isn't capable of getting in and out of it anymore. It's in ok shape but the price has to be right considering the risk.

I need a few people to jump in with me to make it worthwhile but clubs aren't that uncommon so the reality is I need to stop pussyfooting and make it happen.
 
The cable brakes are just fine - that's what my champ has. All it takes is more pressure to hold them and once and a while they need adjustment.

The only time I really use them though is for the run up or tapping them for a tight turn
 
Mechanical brakes work fine as long as they are maintained.
The AD on the wheels is a bit of a PITA.
Not a lot of need for brakes on a Champ.
 
Thanks guys. I'm not worried so much about them not braking as I am not un-braking and causing a wheel to drag or jam.
 
"Average" weight does not include those that have encountered scales since leaving the factory. Be careful with your paperwork.

This comment does not include the 7ECA, which apparently will come within a few lbs of factory weight when placed on accurate scales.
 
Here's the problem with the VanSickle type of mechanical brakes in my opinion; the brake pad surface area is huge and the proper operation is determined solely by the thickness of the brake lining material. There really is no adjustment.
The brake shoes inside the brake drum are spring loaded to pull the shoes away (inward) from the drum. A cam with opposing lobes is attached to the brake actuator lever thru the backing plate. When the brakes are applied by the pedals the movement of the lever rotates the cams lobes to push the shoes apart and into contact with the drum. The problem is the cam/lever is limited in its movement so the difference between brake fully off and fully on is quite small. Add to the mix the large area of the brake shoes and you have a brake system responsible for more damaged airframes and props than any other cause...
Most people I've flown with over the years in Champs with VanSickle brakes always say the same thing: whatever you do, don't touch the brakes!
JMPO
Chris
 
And if you crack a wheel, stand by for the price of a soon-to-crack replacement.

Disc brakes are a lot safer - they modulate, and do not have any servo effects.
 
Bob is correct...the wheels come in two flavors:
DMB 1000 lbs. design load and DHB with a 1500 lb. limit.
The lighter casting DMB is the one subject to the AD for cracking, the heaver DHB has no such AD.
I had a whole set of the VanSickle brakes I took off my Champ but I gave one of my friends the DHB wheels for his Champ last December...
IMAG0312.jpg
Chris
 
The aircraft I converted was a 90 hp version, but cracked a wheel. I found them a complete set of wheels and brakes, and they cracked. I have never seen two guys happier than when they test-flew the Grove setup.

I converted a UPF-7 to Cessna 310 brakes at the urging of Rare Aircraft. Converted that thing from a nasty taildragger to a Cub-like pussycat. Long story short - owner said "we have to do something about that tailwheel." Rare said "not the tailwheel." Rare was correct.

At the time it was tough to get field approvals. I made a very big deal about safety, and they bought it - with some coaxing and persistence. Right now I am not sure what is going on - having difficulty getting data for the L2 Taylorcraft conversion.
 
Doesn't answer e-mails. My field approval requests are now "in the process." I have almost 100% success with legitimate requests.
I was sort of coerced to file a couple for radio installations, and I filed them under protest - they sort of lost them - otherwise I would be 100%.
 
Bob Turner said:
I have a little experience. Got a field approval and installed Grove from one end to the other. Changed the entire personality of the airplane.

Want to do the same thing to a Taylorcraft L2, but the owner likes cable brakes and Shinn wheels. Wait ’till one of those wheels crack . . .
Click to expand...
Bob Turner said:
Doesn't answer e-mails. My field approval requests are now "in the process." I have almost 100% success with legitimate requests.
I was sort of coerced to file a couple for radio installations, and I filed them under protest - they sort of lost them - otherwise I would be 100%.
Click to expand...
Bob Turner said:
I have a little experience. Got a field approval and installed Grove from one end to the other. Changed the entire personality of the airplane.

Want to do the same thing to a Taylorcraft L2, but the owner likes cable brakes and Shinn wheels. Wait ’till one of those wheels crack . . .
Click to expand...
I need brakes for my Champ but not sure where to start. I can't turn using my brakes for nothing. Any suggestions?
 
Yes. Get a field approval first.
Then - the non-TSO parts have become a problem, but hopefully wiser heads will prevail. Once you have a field approval the parts are in fact approved by the FAA - we now need to convince the FAA folks of that.

There is an STC setup, using Cleveland parts. You just buy that, bolt it on, and file a 337. Hideously expensive.
 
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